A hand gesture used while reasoning out very complicated topics, especially when studying Talmud. The speaker does a kind of diagonal thumbs-down and then dips and turns their thumb in a half-circle so that they finish with the thumb pointing up.
Is the nighttime prayer optional or mandatory? If (*thumb dip*) the basis of the daily prayers is from our three forefathers, then the nighttime prayer has the same importance as all the others, and so it's mandatory. But if (*thumb dip*) the basis of the daily prayers is the offerings from the Temple, and we know (*thumb dip*) that no offerings were brought at night, so the nighttime prayer must be optional.
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