I'm glad that you brought that up because it takes me to my second problem with determinism. Let's try and visualize your argument.
D
>ID - ID
R > R
ED
So, and action is either Random (R) or Determined. If it's Determined it's either Internally (ID) or Externally (ED) Determined. If it's Externally Determined, then you have no control. If it's Internally Determined, then the internal determination is either Determined or Random. And I'm guessing that by "Determined" you mean "The necessary byproduct of an antecedent chain in which the actor or mechanism could not have done otherwise," Correct? Is that close? Does that make sense? I feel like there are a lot of presuppositions that need to be unpacked.
Hym "So, how is asking whether or not something is determined or random any different than asking whether or not my bedroom is hot or cold? It's both. And neither. It's, like, luke warm. So, you presuppose the absence of a grey area between determined and random. That random and determine don't exist on a spectrum in the same way hot and cold exist on a spectrum. As though thinks can't be more or less determined or more or less random. Is the outcome of a coin to more or less random than the outcome of rolling a 20 sided dice? You could say that the outcome is determined I guess. By the exact about of force used to roll the dice or flip the coin.
D
>ID - ID
R > R
ED
So, and action is either Random (R) or Determined. If it's Determined it's either Internally (ID) or Externally (ED) Determined. If it's Externally Determined, then you have no control. If it's Internally Determined, then the internal determination is either Determined or Random. And I'm guessing that by "Determined" you mean "The necessary byproduct of an antecedent chain in which the actor or mechanism could not have done otherwise," Correct? Is that close? Does that make sense? I feel like there are a lot of presuppositions that need to be unpacked.
Hym "So, how is asking whether or not something is determined or random any different than asking whether or not my bedroom is hot or cold? It's both. And neither. It's, like, luke warm. So, you presuppose the absence of a grey area between determined and random. That random and determine don't exist on a spectrum in the same way hot and cold exist on a spectrum. As though thinks can't be more or less determined or more or less random. Is the outcome of a coin to more or less random than the outcome of rolling a 20 sided dice? You could say that the outcome is determined I guess. By the exact about of force used to roll the dice or flip the coin.
The relationship between the material of the dice and the material of the surface of the table or the conditions of the air in the room you're flipping the coin. Also, if we accept 'determined' as 'the necessary byproduct of an antecedent chain in which the actor or mechanism could not have done otherwise' you presuppose that what happens in response to a given antecedent chain is what OUGHT to happen in response to said chain. So, Antecedent Chain A -> either Outcome A or Outcome B. If ACA -> OA then you have to presuppose that what ought to happen in response to ACA is OA. If ACA -> OB then, again, you're forced to presuppose that what ought a happen in response to ACA is OB. But if the likelihood of ACA leading to OB is 1% and it HAPPENS ANYWAY... What you have is NOT an outcome that 'couldn't have been otherwise' but, rather, SHOULD have been otherwise and wasn't. Ya feel me? So, I know this doesn't demonstrate free will but I don't think you have been able to successfully demonstrate that there isn't a point at which 'the self' is not the fundamental locus of control in any given choice. It's a good argument though. It's tricky. But it's like a weird semantic blackhole. It's like saying 'Well, if you don't actively control the firing of your neurons, you don't actually control yourself.' Just weird. Determined or random."
by Hym Iam December 5, 2023
Get the Determined or Randommug. When you're on a laptop and you try to move the mouse on the pad and it randomly zooms the fucking thing to like 200% zoom.
Trying to read something on your laptop and it does a random mouse zoom and you can't read the fucking thing.
by Carl Junior Burgers January 16, 2014
Get the Random Mouse Zoommug. by Randomia November 3, 2021
Get the Randommug. Someone who no one really knows, (just seen before and sometimes remembered) but still getting known more frequently over appearing to the same people everyday. (If there are multiple like that there called RANDOMS if there’s one there called a random)
John: “hey Sam, Will, Reed who are you guys again?”
Sam: “I’ve seen you before, you don’t remember me?
Will: “yea you don’t remember me?”
Reed: “yea me to?”
John: “I don’t know you guys, you guys are Randoms , I don’t know I’ll probably start remembering you guys more.”
Sam: “Yea I guess”
Will: “ok”
Reed: “yea I understand”
Sam: “I’ve seen you before, you don’t remember me?
Will: “yea you don’t remember me?”
Reed: “yea me to?”
John: “I don’t know you guys, you guys are Randoms , I don’t know I’ll probably start remembering you guys more.”
Sam: “Yea I guess”
Will: “ok”
Reed: “yea I understand”
by Ian Shandals July 6, 2018
Get the Randomsmug. When Jeremy couldn't decide which ice cream flavor to choose, he had the cashier pick a random one.
OR
Today a random mugged me!
OR
Today a random mugged me!
by BostBro September 19, 2021
Get the randommug. I saw and article about a woman who stabbed a 3 year old... To death! Just... In a grocery store... And I thought to myself... Who did you actually save Rabert Brion Harn? How many? And what (exactly) was I supposed to learn here?
Hym "I wonder... How many of these random acts of violence... Aren't actually random? Don't blame me... I learn it from watch HIM."
by Hym Iam June 7, 2024
Get the Random Acts of Violencemug. When your friend who is also known as “cheap shot motherfucker” or “seagull”,
apparently throws a bag of random garbage in your face while in Manhattan.
apparently throws a bag of random garbage in your face while in Manhattan.
by Bripolar September 25, 2022
Get the Random bag of NYC garbagemug.